The interview

Sisto: 'Prisons, articulated plan against overcrowding'

The Deputy Justice Minister's point: " More alternatives to detention in cells and reduction of pre-trial detention

9 August 2024

3' min read

From the passage of ordinary magistrates to the Surveillance Courts to an ad hoc plan against suicides in prison. These are some of the topics that, as deputy Justice Minister Francesco Paolo Sisto explained, were at the centre of the discussion between government leaders last Wednesday at Palazzo Chigi.

President Mattarella promulgated the Prison Decree only 24 hours after its approval. This may be a sign of the urgency to act. Even if the Dl has to wait for the regulations to become operational..

The dramatic problem of prisons, on which no one has ever intervened before as we are doing, cannot be solved with a snap of the fingers and certainly was not created by this executive. The decree is a first important systemic intervention, which will be followed by others. As far as regulations are concerned, there is an obligation to draft them. We will do this as soon as possible. This is a crucial issue that belongs to the very civilisation of the country.

Let's start with the numbers, which say a lot. There are 61,480 inmates compared to just over 47,000 places. Suicides since the beginning of the year have reached a record 65 for inmates, plus seven prison guards. How do you plan to deal with such a dramatic situation?

The numbers are merciless. And this is the reason why a few hours after the approval of the Dl there was a long meeting at Palazzo Chigi with the government leaders, the same agitation for which Antonio Tajani kicked off Forza Italia's 'Summer in Prison'. There is a need to keep our guard up. But one thing is certain: no automatism will help to tackle overcrowding. Leaving prison because there is no room means certain recidivism. A 'road' that also goes against Article 27 of the Constitution.

So what were the paths identified at the Palazzo Chigi summit?

We have thought of various types of intervention: from increasing the staffing of the supervisory judiciary, to the possibility of applying ordinary magistrates to the supervisory courts themselves, a possibility that is not allowed today, from a greater recourse to public utility work, to the further simplification of the investigation paths to achieve the goal of alternatives to prison. Without neglecting a reflection on suicides to which Minister Nordio has reserved a specific plan in the near future, in addition to the ongoing therapies.

39.7% of prisoners who committed suicide were awaiting trial How important is it to act on pre-trial detention?

The issue of excessive recourse to pre-trial detention has been identified as an important contributor to overcrowding. There is therefore a clear need to intervene on what should be an exceptional measure.

Why the request for a meeting with the Head of State?

It is in the logic of teamwork. It was deemed right to give an account to the President of the Republic, who also presides over the Csm, of the efforts made and to be made on a subject that, as is well known, President Mattarella himself holds dear.

The President of the Republic signed the Nordio bill abolishing abuse of office just yesterday, just hours before the deadline. In the Prisons Decree, the crime of embezzlement by misappropriation was introduced. Is it a substitute, to try to avoid an infringement procedure?

It is not a surrogate. It is a precise, determined case concerning the allocation of funds against specific legal indications. Nothing to do with defensive bureaucracy, with the execrable, especially for citizens, fear of signing.