The clash in the Five Stars

M5s, Patuanelli: 'Second term rule to be overcome. The progressive camp is not in doubt"

Il senatore Stefano Patuanelli ospite alla trasmissione televisiva "Porta a Porta", Roma 21 febbraio 2023. ANSA/MASSIMO PERCOSSI

3' min read

3' min read

"Splits in a community happen when there are parties that are not listened to. But when there is open discussion and everyone can have their say, I see absolutely no reason to fear a split". M5s group leader in the Senate Stefano Patuanelli thus intervenes on the clash taking place between President Giuseppe Conte and Guarantor Beppe Grillo. And he warns: 'If it is decided, as we have decided, to start a constituent process, the members must be able to discuss everything. It will not be me, it will not be Conte or anyone else in the ruling class who will impose the topics, but neither will it be anyone else who will limit them'.

But what does Member Patuanelli think of the second term limit that Grillo wants to maintain?

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I have a total conflict of interest, so it is with this approach, on tiptoe, that I approach the subject. Moreover, I am already in my third term: I served one term in the city council and now I am in my second term in Parliament, which shows that the rule has already changed over the years. After that I believe there is clearly an issue to be addressed without putting solutions first. The issue is the reduced strength with which we are present in the territories in the face of preference champions that push other political forces. One could, for example, provide that where there are preferences one can stand for election regardless
of mandates.

There is also talk of the possibility of changing the name and symbol. Perhaps because they belong to Grillo?

I am a humble engineer and therefore do not go into legal matters. What I can say is that the 5 Star Movement Association was given a new statute when Giuseppe Conte
accepted the challenge to be our president. And so there are all the statutory requirements to decide through the assembly process even the fate of the name and symbol.

In the background there is the political question of alliances, with Grillo evoking the self-sufficiency
of the origins...
.

It will be the assembly that will express itself, of course, but it already seems clear to me that our charter of values anchors us firmly to the progressive camp. But it is the very history of the movement that is anchored there: when we talk about the last, about inequalities, about people who have difficulty making ends meet, about instruments such as the minimum wage, citizenship income and reduced working hours. I don't think our members will take us anywhere else.

Meanwhile, the broad camp seems to be liquefying in Liguria. Does the candidature of former 5-Star Nicola Morra, close to Grillo, condition you?

It makes me smile that today all those former parliamentarians who left the movement when we entered the Draghi government at Grillo's behest are given as being close to Grillo... As for Liguria, we must identify the forces in the field that will support a presidential candidate, and in my opinion there cannot be those who today support the centre-right in Genoa as Italia Viva, then consolidate a programme and finally identify the best interpreter.

But are there any preclusions on the name of Andrea Orlando?

As a former colleague in the Draghi government and having built the conditions for the birth of Count 2 together with him, I could not have any.

What if Renzi leaves the Bucci Council in Genoa?

We have an anthropologically different way of doing politics, beyond issues, things done and things to be done.

The divisions in foreign policy, from Ukraine to Ursula von der Leyen... continue to plague the wide field, however.

If the political forces that make up an alliance had the same positions on everything, they would no longer be a coalition but a single political force. Today in the government Tajani's position on ius scholae is totally different from that of Salvini and Fratelli d'Italia itself, while on conflicts and foreign policy Salvini's position is totally different from that of Tajani and partially of Fratelli d'Italia. Yet they govern together and no one holds the centre-right to account for these deep divisions. I am convinced that the things that unite us are much more than those that divide us.

The margins for the next economic manoeuvre are very tight. What would you give priority to?

The right thing to do is to focus on growth by giving certainty to businesses and households. It means planning long-term measures. I am thinking for example of the Transition 4.0 model, launched when I was at Economic Development, and which for the first time guaranteed businesses a three-year time frame. Unfortunately, AAA wanted Urso, a totally non-existent minister.

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